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MIKESHAW
First Love

United Kingdom
4 Posts

Posted - 05/07/2005 :  00:10:57  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Shortly after Love released their debut album,"Love",in spring 1966,the whole group ,apart from Snoopy,moved into the former home of Norma Talmadge-"The Cedars",4320,Cedarhurst Circle,Los Feliz,L.A.,(Current owner-Xorin Balbes).This house is the one featured on this site as "The Castle".It was built around 1926 and is reputedly a copy of the Italian residence of the Prince of Alba.The group Audioslave recently shot the video for their single "Like A Stone" there.
I think the Bela Lugosi connection is bogus-Lugosi is reputed to have lived in a fairly grand house in Laurel Canyon,while he was successful,but so far I haven't been able to find out exactly where this house was located.Intersestingly Johnny Depp bought "The Cedars" in 1995 and lived there for a short while.He purchased it shortly after making the film "Ed Wood",having developed an interest in Lugosi,via that movie,but he too felt the claim that Lugosi once lived there to be bogus.
"The Cedars" is located in the Los Feliz area of the Hollywood hills,just South of Griffith Park,but East of Laurel Canyon.The Love group lived there untill late 1966,after which Arthur Lee moved to the house featured in the Roger Corman film "The Trip"-the one with the inside/ outside swimming pool and located somewhere on Mulholland Drive.This house is a fairly modern affair with an incredible view over L.A. ;Arthur Lee was inspired to write much of the material from "Forever Changes"while living here,including "The Red Telephone"...."sitting on a hillside watching all the people die"....the sounds of the ambulance and police sirens could be heard in the distance as Arthur gazed down over the city below.This house is not the "Psychedelic Temple"-also featured in the "Trip",but a different building completely.
Interestingly,"The Trip" starred both Peter Fonda and Dennis Hopper who also used the old Talmadge mansion in Los Feliz("The Castle") for the brothel scene in "Easy Rider".There is no mention in the director's commentary for either film of any Arthur Lee/Love connection.
The building featured on the cover of the "Love Story"double CD,with the spiral staircase was yet another different location,(not "The Cedars" or the Trip house).Kenny Forssi,in a '90's interview said it was a geodesic dome type construction,situated on the opposite side of the canyon from the Hollywood sign.It was some kind of temporary exhibit that was lit up at night,but nobody ever lived there.Love simply used it and it's central spiral staircase for some early promotional photo shots.
The cover shots from the first two Love albums-"Love" and "Da Capo",were supposedly shot in the grounds of Bela Lugosi's Laurel Canyon mansion,but I suspect that the claims that it was actually the "Houdini" mansion may well be true,as the location for these photo-shoots has been stated as being on the corner of Lookout Mountain Road and Laurel Canyon road.Frank Zappa's famed log cabin home,(formerly owned by movie star Tom Mix),was located just opposite,untill it burned down in 1980,although the annexe built behind it still stands.Apparently,a tunnel linked the two properties.Again,Love never lived here,but merely used it for the cover shots.

jim
Third Love

United Kingdom
90 Posts

Posted - 05/07/2005 :  00:14:30  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
hey thanks for the additional info.Myself & Allan did a little research into this & i've also spoken with Michael Stuart on the subject.Not just the Music i find interesting.
Thanks again

kind regards jim.
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ALLANAGAIN
Old Love

United Kingdom
687 Posts

Posted - 05/07/2005 :  00:28:29  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Interesting stuff Mike, i was reading NEIL YOUNG,S Biography "SHAKEY"
a nd he also mentions Laurel Canyon , and the scene there in the 60<s....sounds like some trip.....LOVE...Allan
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MIKESHAW
First Love

United Kingdom
4 Posts

Posted - 05/07/2005 :  00:38:01  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Yeah, old Neil was definately friendly with Love.Kenny Forssi stood in for an AWOL Bruce Palmer for a few Buffalo Springfield L.A.gigs in 1967,
and Neil was by all accounts going to co-produce "Forever Changes",but he denies any involvement in the book "Shakey".
If you listen carefully to the "Daily Planet",though,one of those backing vocals sounds remarkably like Neil,(he's supposed to
have had a hand in arranging this particular track.Who knows?
Best,
Mike.
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Allan
Old Love

USA
560 Posts

Posted - 05/07/2005 :  02:03:58  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi Mike.

I'm the Allan that Jim mentions.

I'm somewhat in touch with Michael Stuart. I loaned him The Trip a little while back. He hadn't seen the movie in over 35 years. The film brought back some good memories for him. I believe the Psychedelic Temple was also called the Sans Souci house? Can you confirm?

Also, if you remember in The Trip, what scenes are the Psychedelic Temple? Is it where Fonda just happens into a strange room with the very cool Hopper.

I used to live on Wonderland from 5/70 to 11/70. Michael and Johnny both lived just about around the corner from me...but of course I was a couple years after the fact LOL. Used to go all the way up Wonderland to LookOut and hang out. Met lots of people from all over the country, having fun and sharing stories and getting real high. Used to go to the Country Store and always be seeing a couple guys from The Mothers of Ivention buying 50 cent bottles of ripple...Breakfast of Champions

Here's another link...gigs perfcormed at the Whiskey with dates...

http://hollywoodhangover.com/Corry's%20List%20of%20Bands.htm

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mikeb
Old Love

United Kingdom
515 Posts

Posted - 05/07/2005 :  12:21:59  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Great link, thanks. Looking at those line-ups the Whiskey would have been a second home for me if I had been living in LA at the time
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bob f.
Old Love

USA
1308 Posts

Posted - 06/07/2005 :  05:41:30  Show Profile  Visit bob f.'s Homepage  Reply with Quote
hey' mikeshaw. in the late 60s , i went to a big bashh at '' THE SAN SOUCI CASTLE. a house , slated for demolition. it was a warewell party to the end of this house, and it was a wild party! in the Hollywood area. anyway this house was ROUND! with a ROTUNDA ceiling, LIKE A TEMPLE, AND ALL THE ROOMS IN A CIRCLE, 2 FLOORS. a dome ceiling. a HUGE CHANDELIER HANGING from the top. we all were swinging from it!!! we swung from one end of the balcony, to the other, hanging o the chandelier! we were all high and freaky!. the bash was all night and i slept over in one of the rooms and just left inh the morning. i slept with some girl that night , and slept was maybe it! is this the famouse movie house? anyway , it was the San Couci house.
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myoungish
Fifth Love

USA
264 Posts

Posted - 06/07/2005 :  08:51:00  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Wow. Fascinating and detailed Cedars/Castle info. Thanx. Those early photos with the gothic backdrop added a real heavy layer of mystique that rendered me spellbound as a teenager. I've read that the Castle was also used as a pad for other rock stars visiting the west coast, including Dylan and the Velvet Underground.. And Mike Shaw, I wonder too if that's Neil on The Daily Planet. Isn't it strange that nobody seems to be able to verify too much when it comes to the recording of FC, even something as memorable as Neil Young singing backup or arranging The Daily Planet?(Well, maybe not that strange..)I read a great piece in Mojo a couple of years back about the recording sessions of Sly Stone's There's a Riot Goin' On. There's a similar haziness and murkiness when it comes to anything approaching facts surrounding the recording of the album. To this day, Bobby Womack's still not sure if he's on it....

Michael Young
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MIKESHAW
First Love

United Kingdom
4 Posts

Posted - 06/07/2005 :  20:49:32  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi there Allan,Bob and Michael!I'll try to fill in some additional info in reply.
The only reference to the "Psychedelic Temple"as the "Sans Souci"Mansion comes from several web postings from a certain Angela Douglas (a.k.a.Douglas Czinki)- a transsexual who was briefly a member of the L.A .band-Euphoria,(this is confirmed in the sleevenotes to the group's only album release-"A Gift From Euphoria" (Revola CR REV 55).Although Czinki does not appear on the record,he is mentioned as playing bass for them prior to the album being recorded.Czinki/Douglas also states on several sites,(do a Google search for Angela Douglas,and you'll find 'em),that he had Love/Doors connections.I can't confirm or deny the validity of this info,but Czinki also mentions being friendly with John Phillip Law,(the guy who played the angel in the film,"Barbarella",starring Jane Fonda).In the mid to late '60's John Law co-owned a house called the "Castle"with his brother Tom Law,also situated in the Los Feliz district of L.A.,but not the same house Love lived in.Bob Dylan and the Velvet Underground and Nico were guests there during separate L.A.visits in 1965 or 1966(or both!).The Velvet Underground and Nico returned to stay at the place during the summer of '67,which is when Nico struck up a brief relationship with Jim Morrison of the Doors after a party held at the house.This
event is sketchily portrayed in Oliver Stone's movie "The Doors".
The house had a big central domed roof,so it may be the house you mention,Bob.Red hot Chilli Pepper bassist,Flea owned the property untill fairly recently,(the Chilli Peppers also had cameo roles in the film "Point Break" which featured Love's "7+7 is" on the soundtrack-another little thread!).
Tom Law's wife,Lisa also wrote a respected book,titled,"Flashing on the Sixties"which documents the period well.
The scenes in the movie,"The Trip",which were shot in the "Psychedelic Temple"are the ones that first include Dennis Hopper,as some kind of commune leader.In one scene a joint is being passed around a whole group of people,including Hopper,Fonda and Bruce Dern.There are also some scenes shot outside the house,which is painted with some typically psychedelic designs.The later "dream sequence"shots ,(also featuring Hopper and Fonda),were some of the few scenes from the film that were actually shot in a film studio-not the "Temple".
Hope this helps,
Best,
Mike.
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Loov
Second Love

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 07/07/2005 :  07:21:15  Show Profile  Send Loov a Yahoo! Message  Reply with Quote
I grew up in Los Feliz, as some may be tired of hearing me say, and I think I know what the confusion is about Bela Lugosi. In the same neighborhood as the Castle is an incredible Frank Lloyd Wright structure; the Ennis-Brown House on Glendower:
http://www.greatbuildings.com/buildings/Ennis_House.html
You probably recognize it from films or if you're a Wright fan.
I've been looking but can't substantiate this, but I'd always heard that Bela Lugosi had lived there for a time.
I know this sounds outrageous, but I think an old high school friend of mine bought The Cedars and last I'd heard was renovating it before moving in. We drove by it about a year ago to see the work. At least it was a place on that hill that had been owned by Norma Talmadge...how many can there be? It was just jaw-droppingly beautiful.

http://www.dacamera.org/Concerts/mmf/la_venexiana.htm

Loov
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Allan
Old Love

USA
560 Posts

Posted - 07/07/2005 :  16:15:47  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
MikeShaw...I have shared many letters and e-mails with Angela. She doesn't have her own PC, so she goes to the library and uses a PC there. She lives in Florida. I had sent a VCR of "The Trip" to Angela a while back, and she told me you can see her when she was Doug Czinki in the film. He's the blonde hair guy with Fu Manchu moustache in the scene where Fonda is passing a joint. I think he's 2 people away to Fonda's right side, when the camera is on Fonda.

Angela told me that she used to sing 'Stormy Weather' with Arthur back in the day during band rehearsals. She told me that she helped paint the house with the psychedelic themes for "The Trip". She also lived in The Psychedelic Temple for quite a while. Angela also told me that she thinks his original wife (who left him a long time ago), is the mother of Joan Jett. Angela once sent me a CD of her music. It sounds like Velvet Underground / Doors / Love.

She is a very interesting character.

Allan


Edited by - Allan on 07/07/2005 16:16:59
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Allan
Old Love

USA
560 Posts

Posted - 12/07/2005 :  00:48:47  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
MikeShaw...I have 'The Trip' on CD (the other side is Psyche Out-starring Jack Nicholson-another Corman flick). I watched it again this past week-end. Funny how one can miss things. Just after the opening scene at the beach, the next scene is when Fonda and Dern are getting together to go to some place so that Fonda can experience his first Trip. As they are walking up the steps to the place, the camera shows that the steps leading up the front door were all painted a different color. When Dern and Fonda are both at the front door, you can see writing on the door that says 'Psychedelic Temple'(I've never noticed this before-so it prompted me to come back and add yet another reply LOL). So that scene with them passing the joint must have been filmed there. A bit further in the movie, Fonda is tripping his brains out in a place that has an indoor-outdoor pool, and that mysterious 'closet'. That must've been Arthur's home on (Blue Jay Way-I think )?

Allan
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Tanglehead
First Love

USA
12 Posts

Posted - 16/11/2005 :  22:29:37  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by MIKESHAW

Hi there Allan,Bob and Michael!I'll try to fill in some additional info in reply.
The only reference to the "Psychedelic Temple"as the "Sans Souci"Mansion comes from several web postings from a certain Angela Douglas (a.k.a.Douglas Czinki)- a transsexual who was briefly a member of the L.A .band-Euphoria,(this is confirmed in the sleevenotes to the group's only album release-"A Gift From Euphoria" (Revola CR REV 55).Although Czinki does not appear on the record,he is mentioned as playing bass for them prior to the album being recorded.Czinki/Douglas also states on several sites,(do a Google search for Angela Douglas,and you'll find 'em),that he had Love/Doors connections.I can't confirm or deny the validity of this info,but Czinki also mentions being friendly with John Phillip Law,(the guy who played the angel in the film,"Barbarella",starring Jane Fonda).In the mid to late '60's John Law co-owned a house called the "Castle"with his brother Tom Law,also situated in the Los Feliz district of L.A.,but not the same house Love lived in.Bob Dylan and the Velvet Underground and Nico were guests there during separate L.A.visits in 1965 or 1966(or both!).The Velvet Underground and Nico returned to stay at the place during the summer of '67,which is when Nico struck up a brief relationship with Jim Morrison of the Doors after a party held at the house.This
event is sketchily portrayed in Oliver Stone's movie "The Doors".
The house had a big central domed roof,so it may be the house you mention,Bob.Red hot Chilli Pepper bassist,Flea owned the property untill fairly recently,(the Chilli Peppers also had cameo roles in the film "Point Break" which featured Love's "7+7 is" on the soundtrack-another little thread!).
Tom Law's wife,Lisa also wrote a respected book,titled,"Flashing on the Sixties"which documents the period well.
The scenes in the movie,"The Trip",which were shot in the "Psychedelic Temple"are the ones that first include Dennis Hopper,as some kind of commune leader.In one scene a joint is being passed around a whole group of people,including Hopper,Fonda and Bruce Dern.There are also some scenes shot outside the house,which is painted with some typically psychedelic designs.The later "dream sequence"shots ,(also featuring Hopper and Fonda),were some of the few scenes from the film that were actually shot in a film studio-not the "Temple".
Hope this helps,
Best,
Mike.

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Tanglehead
First Love

USA
12 Posts

Posted - 16/11/2005 :  22:43:28  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi, just saw Mike Shaw's post. Ok, he is wrong. First off, I left Ruphoria in late 66, known as Doug Delain then. Bill Lincoln played bass, wesley Watt lead guitart, Dave Potter drums, I was lead singer, rhythm guitarist. I never played bass at all. I did not know Watt, Lincoln got an LP out on Capitol in 69 or was mentioned at all on the jacket until someone told me a couple of years ago, never heard of that LP. Watt appartently becameIrish Vivian campbell of Def leppard. Potter died in the 80 MGM vegas fire with, I think, Tom Thompson, manager of Bido Lito;s, the club Love formed at in 65 where Euphoria also formed. I never recorded at all with Euphoria, it was an off again on again bar band. I did record 2 sdongs in a greage studio in 66 with Forssi and Pfisterer, got some vinyls made, Trapped, C'est Dommage, may still be flaoting around LA. A Bill Lincon trio wsas at the Kahala Hilton Hawaii in 79. John Phillip Law is stone gay and I stayed with him and his rich pal Bob Magoon at the expesnive Diamondhead Mansion for awhile in 68, with hendrix next door. Law was in Barbarrella, with Jane Fonda, as the angel. I don't know if he was kin to John Law who own3ed the Sans SOuci in LA, possibly. Mike is right. There are two scenss in The Trip filmed there. Fonda, Dern drive up, bikerrs in front including Roland God barnett of The barons, I painted LOVE" on the street, did some of the art onhe film. Hoppwer is pass9ing joints around. i am in that scene, so is yougn furture billionaire Paul Allen, a wanna be bass player then, hung out now and then there, helped me set up hendrix's gear for a promo f9ilm hendrix made there in 68. What is strange I flew off to Hawaii a bit later, sat in with a band at a cluib right after I got off the plane, they let me crash at their place and I woke up on Sans Souci beach, rather ran into Law and stayed with him. Weird.Then hen drix moves next door! I dropped by had drinks with him, remembered me from LA, called me "the T-shirt kid." Whatever. I recall those days, Arthur, all of it vividly. Anyway, I have books out, a CD cut in o3, live as a man despite a 70's sex change, long story, 10 FBI and one SS inigation since 81 due to wars with Hollywood types maulinory for films, TV sued some in 87, SS on me in 00 as a lesbian Gore backer got upset I supported Bush, who I later asked to get lee out of jail, maybe he did! Clinton wanted money, of course. Get my books, and I run them on eBay now and then. FBI files, $50, foreign $60, Hollywood's Bsession, ton of stuff,$25, foreign $35, my CD, $10, foreign $15. Money ordcr preferred, I have more stuff, too. Hope to start performingh some band soon, I am definely rocking. My CD is totally freakit, ask Jim Belushi, also kevibanks at Jay leno! Got to run. Angela Douglas is my legal name, Douglas Carl Czinki my name os birth, I am discussed in some books, too. 7520 Hwy. 90, Sneads, FL 32460
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johnnylovejoy
Second Love

38 Posts

Posted - 17/11/2005 :  00:10:39  Show Profile  Visit johnnylovejoy's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Sorry folks, Neil Young did not sing on Forever Changes, that high voice you hear is Bryan! Neil needed money at the time, and was a close friend of Arthur and I__ as well as the rest of the group, so we tried to get him a paycheck as "Producer" It was a Disaster!! We were going through changes at the time, such as Bryan and Kenny "slacking off" on Arthur's songs, in order for Bryan to have more of his songs on FC. The ploy didn't work, so after a couple hours with studio musicians trying__ too sound like us on "Daily Planet everybody went back to work. "An interesting note" that's Kenny Forssi playing bass on "Happy Together" by the Turtles. :Johnny Echols

Edited by - johnnylovejoy on 17/11/2005 00:12:21
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kdion11
Old Love

USA
552 Posts

Posted - 17/11/2005 :  00:52:13  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Yep, I always seriously doubted Neil Young "going to produce" Forever Changes. I mean come on ! In 1967 Neil Young was 22 years old, and was hardly a big star or big name. He'd never "produced" anything at that point and was simply one of 3 guitarists in The Buffalo Springfield, who weren't even as big as Love were at that time in LA !

Free the truth !


quote:
Originally posted by MIKESHAW

Yeah, old Neil was definately friendly with Love.Kenny Forssi stood in for an AWOL Bruce Palmer for a few Buffalo Springfield L.A.gigs in 1967,
and Neil was by all accounts going to co-produce "Forever Changes",but he denies any involvement in the book "Shakey".
If you listen carefully to the "Daily Planet",though,one of those backing vocals sounds remarkably like Neil,(he's supposed to
have had a hand in arranging this particular track.Who knows?
Best,
Mike.

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