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BobbyFischer
Fifth Love
Norway
440 Posts |
 Posted - 07/12/2009 : 23:34:31
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| I dont quite belive the tournament experience of England counts for so much either. Teams like Germany, Brazil and Argentina have broken the code so to speak and always get to final or close, for those teams tournament experience is an important factor for succsess, Like Germany except for lately always seems to play for half machine and keeps getting to the quarter final with close margin. England is much more unstable and havent won since 66 even not been to the final since then. |
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caryne
Old Love
United Kingdom
1520 Posts |
Posted - 07/12/2009 : 23:50:29
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quote:
Originally posted by BobbyFischer
I dont quite belive the tournament experience of England counts for so much either. Teams like Germany, Brazil and Argentina have broken the code so to speak and always get to final or close, for those teams tournament experience is an important factor for succsess, Like Germany except for lately always seems to play for half machine and keeps getting to the quarter final with close margin. England is much more unstable and havent won since 66 even not been to the final since then.
Very true, Bobby, except neither Germany, Brazil or Argentina are in the group that England are in (which is what we were discussing here). Though saying that, Argentina only just managed to qualify this time around and, personally, I would be putting Spain and Portugal in the list you mention of teams 'most likely to'.
PS And probably best not to mention how Argentina managed to beat England in a World Cup a few years back |
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BobbyFischer
Fifth Love
Norway
440 Posts |
Posted - 08/12/2009 : 00:06:04
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| I know, just meant to say they dont have that championship "karma" or luck (like Argentina recently :-) that these teams have so they have to really perform even if all the teams in their groups are lower ranked. |
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Kula John
Old Love
United Kingdom
756 Posts |
Posted - 08/12/2009 : 13:38:14
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quote:
Originally posted by caryne
quote:
Originally posted by Kula John
As usual the English press have been highly patronising to the teams that stand in our way in South Africa. I know I should be patriotic and support my team but if the USA were to beat us in game one I would find it hard not to have a little grin on my face. Half of our players think the sun shines out of their rear ends.
This is the time and this is the time and it is time, time, time, time, time, time, time.....
I actually think 99.9% of all players of any nationality think the sun shines out of their rear end (that probably goes for most professional sports people if I think about it).
I often get a smile when a tiny nation beats a large one at any sport BUT, and I am just being factual here, the other three teams in England's group are of (general) lower ability level so I'm not sure it's really patronising to speak the truth. Of course unexpected results can happen, England could end up bottom and be coming home really soon, but the hard facts are it would be a bigger shame if that happened to them than to any of the other sides in their group where the expectation is less. This isn't being patronising or patriotic it's just speaking of statistics in the same way that if, say, in Tennis, Roger Federer was playing someone seeded 100 places below him, you would, normally, be expecting Federer to win.
I just feel that some people in the media were a bit patronising by celebrating our path through to the 2nd round as if the other countries don't exist and that they may as well not turn up for their match against England as it'll be a complete waste of time. Am I right in thinking the USA beat us fairly recently?
This is the time and this is the time and it is time, time, time, time, time, time, time.....
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caryne
Old Love
United Kingdom
1520 Posts |
Posted - 08/12/2009 : 13:55:46
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quote:
Originally posted by Kula John
quote:
Originally posted by caryne
quote:
Originally posted by Kula John
As usual the English press have been highly patronising to the teams that stand in our way in South Africa. I know I should be patriotic and support my team but if the USA were to beat us in game one I would find it hard not to have a little grin on my face. Half of our players think the sun shines out of their rear ends.
This is the time and this is the time and it is time, time, time, time, time, time, time.....
I actually think 99.9% of all players of any nationality think the sun shines out of their rear end (that probably goes for most professional sports people if I think about it).
I often get a smile when a tiny nation beats a large one at any sport BUT, and I am just being factual here, the other three teams in England's group are of (general) lower ability level so I'm not sure it's really patronising to speak the truth. Of course unexpected results can happen, England could end up bottom and be coming home really soon, but the hard facts are it would be a bigger shame if that happened to them than to any of the other sides in their group where the expectation is less. This isn't being patronising or patriotic it's just speaking of statistics in the same way that if, say, in Tennis, Roger Federer was playing someone seeded 100 places below him, you would, normally, be expecting Federer to win.
I just feel that some people in the media were a bit patronising by celebrating our path through to the 2nd round as if the other countries don't exist and that they may as well not turn up for their match against England as it'll be a complete waste of time. Am I right in thinking the USA beat us fairly recently?
This is the time and this is the time and it is time, time, time, time, time, time, time.....
I don't disagree, you should never 'count your chickens' as freak results can always happen in any game. Like I said though, statistically, England should win..doesn't mean they will though. I'm no football expert and I'm sure the USA have beaten England at some time but the last game I can think of was at Wembley last year(May 2008) when England beat them 2.0. |
Edited by - caryne on 08/12/2009 13:56:32 |
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rocker
Old Love
USA
3606 Posts |
Posted - 08/12/2009 : 14:20:02
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Hmmm..so may I ask what the English press has been saying about the upcoming game??? My guess is that they'd think they can win but they stillhave to 'respect' the US. True? I listened to a phone in on Fox last night with Eric Wynalda (US most prolific goal scorer) and his English counterpart Nick Webster debating the outcome of the game. Webster sees a 2-0 win for England noting that the US outside backs could be weak and vulnerable. Wynalda sees a 1-1 game. Interesting that he didn't come up with saying 2-1 to the Americans! See? Even he thinks it's gonna be hard And just one thing. I wonder what Torben's thinking when he eavesdrops here. Ah Denmark. Not exactly a team to be dismissed. Could be the dark horse of the tournament. They look like they'll get out of their group! |
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caryne
Old Love
United Kingdom
1520 Posts |
Posted - 08/12/2009 : 14:26:38
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I can't say I've noticed the press saying much, the TV pundits certainly thought England had a pretty easy group when it was drawn but I havn't noticed much being said anywhere since.
Maybe Torben doesn't care about football? Denamark aren't a bad team though, but I can't see them winning overall... |
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rocker
Old Love
USA
3606 Posts |
Posted - 08/12/2009 : 18:30:23
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Torben's quiet.wonder if he knows anything about those "bets" in Europe...
And tell me will we see Becks out there? Is he a high choice with Capello? |
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Kula John
Old Love
United Kingdom
756 Posts |
Posted - 08/12/2009 : 21:13:58
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I'm not sure about Becks. Capello is very much his own man and won't worry about upsetting people by not taking Becks. I'm torn really. Part of me says we should take him as in all fairness to Beckham (and I'm by no way his biggest fan) he is passionate and you do get the feeling he genuinely cares about pulling on the shirt and wearing the 3 lions  . He also still has a lot of quality and can deliver that killer pass or cross.
However, we have some young, pacey wingers playing well in the premiership (Lennon, Wright-Phillips, etc) who may on paper offer a little bit more than Becks. I also wish Beckham would perhaps forget about the celeb culture he seems to chase and just keep his head down and concentrate on all things football.
It would be good to see Becks have one last shot and what a great story it would be if he played a part in a successful tournament. I have a feeling though that Capello will be ruthless and unless he is playing regularly for Milan Beckham may miss out.
This is the time and this is the time and it is time, time, time, time, time, time, time.....
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rocker
Old Love
USA
3606 Posts |
Posted - 08/12/2009 : 21:46:45
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kula...
Good points you made. I don't think he's can be considered "Flash" but your comment about the "pacey wingers" may help him get out there doing his damage out there. Question is would he be a defensive liability which would cancel out his potential offensive effectiveness? I don't know. Maybe those wingers might have to strap some oxygen onto their backs??? On the other hand, Cappello will be ruthless as you say. The English guys he picks I know will die out there no doubt about it. The spirit cojuld be willing for some but the flesh will be weak. And man if I was a US back I'd be jangling in my jock seeing the likes of a Rooney or a Lennon come running at me when millions are watching...God bless'em and protect them.. |
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BobbyFischer
Fifth Love
Norway
440 Posts |
Posted - 08/12/2009 : 21:59:23
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Have to love the Sun,not for its journalism but for its often brilliant over patriotic and optimistic sport headlines with funny word plays "best english group since the Beatles" ! and not least their cover after the drawing on whole front page:
England
Algerie
Slovenia
Yanks
EASY!! |
Edited by - BobbyFischer on 08/12/2009 22:01:29 |
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rocker
Old Love
USA
3606 Posts |
Posted - 08/12/2009 : 22:27:43
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| heh heh now that's great!........football's great to argue about, eh? |
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John9
Old Love
United Kingdom
2154 Posts |
Posted - 08/12/2009 : 23:47:54
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| Thinking back to the time when we did last win it - in 1966.....it gave such an incredible lift to the nation. For example it got grannies interested in soccer for the first time. People were actually throwing themselves into the fountains in Trafalgar Square amid scenes of frenzy. I remember saying to my mum at the time that it was far better for national pride to be channeled that way.....than in armed conflict. Harold Wilson's Labour government won a second term of office, partly on the back of the triumph. And of course.....the music......oh the music. Dylan had Blonde on Blonde out, the Stones were there with Aftermath and of course the Beatles with Revolver. The Byrds were releasing Fifth Dimension and we were seeing first albums from the Airplane, the Mothers.......and from a new little Los Angeles band whose name escapes me for the present. But more than any of this, Marianne Faithfull and Francoise Hardy were looking ever more lovely with each passing day. As Wordsworth once wrote of another time: "To be young was very heaven". |
Edited by - John9 on 09/12/2009 00:00:16 |
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BobbyFischer
Fifth Love
Norway
440 Posts |
Posted - 09/12/2009 : 15:48:22
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| Great post John! Even though England "only" have won the World Cup once you sure picked the perfect year to do it,The greatest year of mankind to paraphrase Withnail and I |
Edited by - BobbyFischer on 09/12/2009 15:53:43 |
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John9
Old Love
United Kingdom
2154 Posts |
Posted - 09/12/2009 : 20:47:29
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| Thanks Bobby - and Withnail and I is a terrific film. What was that immortal line shouted out in a quiet little tearoom in Keswick? It went something like this: "I demand the finest wines this country has to offer.....I want them here........and I want them now!" |
Edited by - John9 on 09/12/2009 20:48:33 |
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World Cup 2010
