| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Wendy from When |
Posted - 11/09/2005 : 10:00:23
Well Mike I must say I disagree with your assesment of Kanye West's blurt. However "inappropriate" we may think his timing was/is (and you may be right about that) something certainly needed to be said. For George Bush to have spent over 200 billion dollars to "bring democracy to Iraq" and then falter and fail to bring the benefits of that democracy to his own countrymen is a high crime in my book. Whether Kanye's comments as to George Bush's racism are on the mark or not I don't think he could have picked a better forum. He has subsequently donated quite a lot of money to the relief fund. Not to put too fine a point on it but all i see coming out of your "pie hole" is twat about loosing weight! Now that's important stuff. When artists (however you may feel about them) stop speaking up and using their fame to at least try and make a difference...well they might as well all go on a long diet because they will have all lost whatever weight they have...as in lightweight.
I guarantee you that had a storm hit Kennybunkport Maine or Crawford Texas the response would have been a hell of lot faster. The pictures we here in England saw looked like a 3rd world country and the response was the same as well. Shame!!! I know this is not the place for a full blown political tirade but since you brought it up in your "diaries" I felt an answer was called for. The script that the presenters were reading from was inane and even though Kanye West seemed to be blurting all over the place I know quite a lot of people were feeling him. With 5 million people or more watching at least someone had the courage to say what they thought instead of what they were told to say. Some people take things to heart, mate and injustice needs to be spoken on.
Peace |
| 15 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| stefaan |
Posted - 29/09/2005 : 15:05:53
Being an European, and seen it been mensoined a few times here: What is George Bush going to do after Katrina and Rita.Who's to blame? What country will be invaded now? My guess is Cuba: he may be old and grey by now, but Castro still makes a lot of wind when he's holding a speach for 4 or more hours. |
| ocfan |
Posted - 27/09/2005 : 22:26:13
I happen to be white and I stand by my previous comments. I abhor racism and bigotry in any form. Unfortunately, as I have also said before, it has and will always exist, be it by racism, religous bias, sexism and on and on. There will always be someone who attempts to make himself feel better by looking down on others. And unfortunately, again it goes both ways. Am I unaware of it's existence. Nope, just tried to raise my kid to not believe in such hogwash.
But that's another topic isn't it?
Cheryl |
| maldurqoue |
Posted - 27/09/2005 : 22:17:24
Well ocfan, I see you looked deep into your heart.
History is more than just a journal of our past. History is who and why we are today. Furthermore, I never said that racism is confined to history, it has a very real though often more subtle present and future in this country. If you don't believe that especially in light of recent events then you have indeed lived behind the Orange curtain for far too long.
All I actually asked of you, instead of giving me your standard issue response, was to really think about how we got to where we are today and to see if you can at least attempt to see not the merits, because there are none, but at least the differences and causes of white on black vs black on white racism. Of course, we'd all like racism to go away, but just because Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity have decleared it vanquished and that anyone who dares mention it is a "race-baiter", it sure doesn't make it so.
One last local example for you. Were you aware that up until the mid 1980's the Newport Beach police had an unofficial but oft used radio designation called 'NIN'? It stood for 'nigger in Newport' and was used when an African Amercian was spotted in the Newport Beach city limits by a police officer. Imagine that, you're black you're in the city of Newport - these are your only transgressions - and the police feel a need to alert each other as to your presence.It was in regular use until a newspaper exposed it. The chief at the time admitted its use, tried to dismiss it as no longer in use, and then apologized and guaranteed it would no longer be used.
OCFan, I ask you, was the mid 1980's 'way before your time'?
-Mal-
Silence is a sound we hear far too little of these days. |
| ladylove |
Posted - 27/09/2005 : 21:36:52
So well put, Mal, I couldn't have put it better myself. Thanks for your words, which I find refreshing considering all the pettiness that's been going on here. So many emotions attempting to express their disappointment and frustrations more than often come flooding out with no self-censorship. Totally understandable, we're all feeling it.
Cheryl, I respectfully have to address your comments. As much as I wish it were true; unfortunately, whites weren't just assholes long before your time. Sadly, racism still rears its ugly head today. Ever heard of DWB? 'Driving While Black' exists for a reason -- it really happens TODAY along with many more violations of civil rights. It just depends on the lifestyle one lives as to whether they have exposure to this evil force.
LOVE and peace |
| ocfan |
Posted - 27/09/2005 : 20:56:32
Two wrongs don't make a right. Am I do assume that reverse racism is an okay thing because white's were @#*holes, long before my time?
And true, silence is golden. The animosity going on is a bit much for me.
Scottish Kieth said it all.
Cheryl |
| maldurqoue |
Posted - 27/09/2005 : 10:41:14
Who are all these people who just showed up? I'm one of them and I'm also the one who emailed MR that nasty little letter. I've had time to re-examine my stance and I've realized that I've judged Mike a bit too harshly. It was a knee jerk response.
By way of explanation: I was quite distressed at the Katrina catastrophe, I was outraged by the lack of initial support, rescue and lack of humanity at all levels, particularly the federal. Kanye West spoke for many of us that day and said something, almost cathartic, that was long in coming regarding Republican administrations over the years and then Mike - in what also appeared to be a knee jerk response - castigated Mr West for his very apporpriate comments (for those who think the relief effort was hindered by Kanye;honestly, what kind of inhuman scumbag would be watching the fund raiser and say 'Ya know I was all set to help them poor victims, the destitute and homeless. I wanted to ease their pain and do the humanitarian thing, but that loudmouth dissed the president so I'm keeping my MONEY!!') and came off sounding just like "them" with their "now is not the time to play the blame game" misdirection. Re-reading his diary I still find his comments regarding Kanye West overly harsh seemingly lacking awareness of the underlying history that would elicit such a statement from Kanye West, but again, I believe Mike's take that day to be - as mine was to him - 90% emotion, 10% thought.
Some of you may accept and understand my explanation, for those who don't: pillory away!
Lastly on the Katrina subject, let me list three of the many things that would've been different if Al Gore had been president (probably Kerry too, but I'm not as certain)
1) The funding for the levee project would not have been slashed so there is a chance that enough of it would have been completed as to withstand the torrential assault.
2) Since there would be no war in Iraq, the National Guard would have beeen at full strength in Louisiana and Mississippi rather than the 35% from each state that is currently deployed "elsewhere"
3) Al Gore, like Clinton before him, would have hired someone qualified, with actual disaster experience, to head FEMA instead of having a political crony and former head of the International Arabian Horse Society in charge. I think the rescue effort might have gone just a BIT better.
A couple of notes:
To Wendy: I enjoy both your posts and your tenacity. Your only 'sin' around here was causing a release from a couple of rather large gasbags who hate the see their designated status quo upended.
To OCFan: I have to take you to task on your "there's black racism againt whites too" comment. Now I'm not condoning hatred and bigotry on anyone's part but before you try to equate the two, look into your heart and ask yourself this: over the last 400 years or so what things have African Americans done to engender the hatred of whites, and, in the same time period, what things have white people done to engender the hatred and distrust of African-Americans?
Whew, being my first post and all, I was going to introduce myself, but I'll put that on separate post to keep this from becoming a marathon.
-Mal-
Silence is a sound we hear far too little of these days. |
| waxburn |
Posted - 14/09/2005 : 20:28:57
quote:
Originally posted by Judith
Agree with you Phil Brauer but I don't think anybody's 'gone after' Wendy, or her support of AL. There was a lot of support for AL intially here but that seems to have dropped off as well-inevitable I think with latter postings. I wonder if AL knows what's been written? We'll never know!
Arthur has NOT taken sides on the KW controversy.
When Arthur puts out a new cd, I will be the first to buy, and when he makes his comeback gig( JE in the picture now?) I will be the
first in line.  
I think Arthur knows what is being written, from his brief remarks to the LA newspaper. |
| Judith |
Posted - 14/09/2005 : 11:30:46
Agree with you Phil Brauer but I don't think anybody's 'gone after' Wendy, or her support of AL. There was a lot of support for AL intially here but that seems to have dropped off as well-inevitable I think with latter postings. I wonder if AL knows what's been written? We'll never know! |
| Phil Brauer |
Posted - 14/09/2005 : 10:53:13
Aight. I probably need to take a chill pill. I am, and most everyone I care about, are very upset over everything the Bush Crime Family does...and I do think they were criminally negligent in their handling of the hurricane, and in their illegal war, which we don't even hear about anymore, do we? enough politics. I am watching the Love DVD right now, and I guess I am upset that AL is such a brilliant ****-up. But what are you gonna do? I truly do hope that we can hear some new music from Love (Gethsemane). I also feel like you guys are ganging up on Wendy for no reason that I can see, other than that she still supports AL. (however, I haven't read every one of her post's, maybe there is something I am missing?) But every post I have seen seems reasonable, nothing to go after her for. The world is f-d up right now, AL is f-d up (but I can't blame him for seeking escape, being tired of the bull****, etc) Anyway, now I'm ramblin', two pints down and ready to go to bed. Peace, Phil. |
| astrolobe33 |
Posted - 14/09/2005 : 06:14:52
Well, I think after all everbody here must be cool, or else they wouldn't be here (this board), and I'm sure that's the case. We all gots our differences natch. No reason to |=*<% it up just because life has been doling out a little extra weirdness in the recent past..
Just thinkin' out loud,
Jon |
| Cardiff Anne |
Posted - 14/09/2005 : 03:44:45
Having been a member since April 2005, I've read and enjoyed this messageboard but have never made a post. I've been a big fan of AL for many years but unfortunately, due to particular posts made by one person, this has changed for me. I felt that posts made initially by Wendy from When about AL were sympathetic and honest but have now turned into something bordering on the ridiculous, with no responses to topics other than those where the Love Band, especially MR can be slated. These postings have certainly brought about two camps and I know which one I'm in. Roll it out boys, while I wait for the onslaught. |
| ocfan |
Posted - 14/09/2005 : 02:24:16
This is a post from Bill Weiler, freelance journalist, over in Merritt
Island, FL, who has been researching what went on before the storm hit.
These are the authors comment - I find them very interesting.
Politics over Duty
I think all of Mayor Nagin's pomp and posturing is going to bite him hard
in the near future as the lies and distortions of his interviews are coming
to light.
On Friday night before the storm hit Max Mayfield of the National Hurricane
Center took the unprecedented action of calling Mayor Nagin and Governor
Blanco personally to plead with them to begin MANDATORY evacuation of New
Orleans and they said they'd take it under consideration. This was after
the NOAA buoy 240 miles south had recorded 68' waves before it was
destroyed.
President Bush spent Friday afternoon and evening in meetings with his
advisors and administrators drafting all of the paperwork required for a
state to request federal assistance (and not be in violation of the Posse
Comitatus Act or having to enact the Insurgency Act). Just before midnight
Friday evening the President called Governor Blanco and pleaded with her to
sign the request papers so the federal government and the military could
legally begin mobilization and call up. He was told that they didn't think
it necessary for the federal government to be involved yet. After the
President's final call to the governor she held meetings with her staff to
discuss the political ramifications of bringing federal forces. It was
decided that if they allowed federal assistance it would make it look as if
they had failed so it was agreed upon that the feds would not be invited in.
Saturday before the storm hit the President again called Gov. Blanco and
Mayor Nagin requesting they please sign the papers requesting federal
assistance, that they declare the state an emergency area, and begin
mandatory evacuation. After a personal plea from the President, Nagin
agreed to order an evacuation, but it would not be a full mandatory
evacuation, and the governor still refused to sign the papers requesting
and authorizing federal action. In frustration the President declared the
area a national disaster area before the state of Louisiana did so he could
legally begin some advanced preparations. Rumor has it that the President's
legal advisers were looking into the ramifications of using the insurgency
act to bypass the Constitutional requirement that a state request federal
id before the federal government can move into state with troops - but
that had not been done since 1906 and the Constitutionality of it was called
into question to use before the disaster.
Throw in that over half the federal aid of the past decade to New Orleans
for levee construction, maintenance, and repair was diverted to fund a
marina and support the gambling ships. Toss in the investigation that will
look into why the emergency preparedness plan submitted to the federal
government for funding and published on the city's website was never
implemented and in fact may have been bogus for the purpose of gaining
additional federal funding as we now learn that the organizations
identified in the plan were never contacted or coordinating into any
planning - though the document implies that they were.
The suffering people of New Orleans need to be asking some hard questions
as do we all, but they better start with why Blanco refused to even sign
the multi-state mutual aid pack activation documents until Wednesday which
further delayed the legal deployment of National Guard from adjoining
states. Or maybe ask why Nagin keeps harping that the President should have
commandeered 500 Greyhound busses to help him when according to his own
emergency plan and documents he claimed to have over 500 busses at his
disposal to use between the local school busses and the city transportation
busses - but he never raised a finger to prepare them or activate them.
This is a sad time for all of us to see that a major city has all but been
destroyed and thousands of people have died with hundreds of thousands more
suffering, but it's certainly not a time for people to be pointing fingers
and trying to find a bigger dog to blame for local corruption and
incompetence.
Pray to God for the survivors that they can start their lives
anew as fast as possible and we learn from all the mistakes to avoid them
in the future.
This was emailed to me by a friend. Thought I should share it. And Allanagain I agree. Phil, this is really a nice group of people and Mike is not by any means a George Bush lover.
I just hope they both parties are successful in their future endeavors and that the sniping and condenscending comments would stop.
Peace
Cheryl |
| ALLANAGAIN |
Posted - 14/09/2005 : 01:49:26
Hi Phil,
it dosent matter to me if someone has been posting for years, or if they have just heard even their first LOVE track ever.
EVERONES veiwpoint is valad,and all have the rite to say what they feel.
To anyone who has just started posting here,,,,WELCOME TO LOVE LAND.  
The more new members and different points of veiw we have here, the more healthier, with NOW more than ever a time for us all to do our best efforts towards keeping TORBEN,s site interesting and flowing.
LOVE..............................Allan |
| kdion11 |
Posted - 14/09/2005 : 01:47:38
WW wrote:
"Realize this...When the tornado (i don't remember which one) hit Florida, the whole state was declared a Federal Disaster Zone and aid was on the way within 1 day! Jeb Bush, younger brother of George, is the Governor of Florida. What is wrong with this picture?"
What is wrong with this picture is that you (once again) have your
facts wrong, that's what. First off its a hurricane, not a tornado, - big difference there to begin with. And trust me folks, as a life long WAY liberal democrat and someone who is consistantly ANTI BUSH across the board on all issues, the ball was truely dropped by FEMA, as George Bush delcared the entire Gulf Region a National Disaster Area the DAY BEFORE the hurricane hit.
Sure, George Bush appointed Michael "The Dork" Brown (FEMA Director who just resigned), and is responsible for that bad hire, but get your facts straight. Your analogy about Jeb and the Florida "tornado" is laughable. |
| Phil Brauer |
Posted - 14/09/2005 : 00:11:55
"I too wonder from where these people have suddenly arrived. And their motives."
Well, I arrived from California, and only discovered the website/diaries/messageboard recently. I have only seen Love twice, but have been a fan for twenty years or so. I am sure my qualifications are not up to par for all of you who wonder where I, and others came from. Sorry, but I still listen to Love all the time. Hope that's OK with you. If you don't want new people/viewpoints on your board then you should make it a closed society with no new members allowed. I still think MR's comments about KW were pretty lame. And his recent protests about Bush seem like they came after the fact...and his comment about how he sometimes votes republican...I don't know..I definitely have my doubts about where MR stands politically, and I get a vibe that it's more to the right than I would be able to support. This will be my last post on these boards, so don't worry about me ruining your sycophantic society. |
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