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lemonade kid
Old Love
USA
9876 Posts |
 Posted - 17/09/2014 : 17:44:35
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Tomorrow's the big vote.
Would love to hear some thoughts from Scotsmen and UK ...
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"After silence, that which comes nearest to expressing the inexpressible is music".
-Aldous Huxley
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DaveyTee
Fourth Love
United Kingdom
238 Posts |
Posted - 18/09/2014 : 09:01:28
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Well, I've just cast my vote in what is without doubt the most important election in which I have ever participated. A big fat YES from me.
I just hope that my fellow Scots are brave and smart enough to ignore the constant stream of misinformation and downright lies with which we have been deluged by the UK government, the mainstream media and, perhaps most disappointingly of all, the BBC over the last few months. Once I used to believe that the BBC was a fair and impartial organisation. That is no longer the case and the BBC, at least in its news capacity, appears to be little more than a mouthpiece of the UK Establishment. Sadly, I shall never again view a BBC news bulletin with any confidence that they're telling us the truth.
DT
But I Can't Understand
Why We Let Someone Else
Rule Our Land
Cap in Hand.
(The Proclaimers) |
Edited by - DaveyTee on 18/09/2014 09:28:32 |
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John9
Old Love
United Kingdom
2154 Posts |
Posted - 18/09/2014 : 10:08:36
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Thanks for raising this, LK. The UK has during the last few weeks been in the grip of an existential crisis and I think that most people will welcome the end of the uncertainty that tomorrow morning should bring. In the end of course it is entirely a matter for the people of Scotland. This said, I would be sad to see the break-up of our union....but if that's the way it's going to go, then all everyone else can do is respect the outcome.
I do believe that the 'No' campaign has been grossly mismanaged - and that a much more positive case for the Union could have been presented. I just hope that whichever way things go, we can avoid all unseemly triumphalism - and instead place the emphasis on healing and reconciliation - there is after all, enough division in the world.
I must confess to being fascinated by politics - and by elections especially. And so I shall be getting back home by 9pm to take my place by the telly - for what is certain to be a long night - and I shall relish every moment. |
Edited by - John9 on 18/09/2014 10:17:54 |
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DaveyTee
Fourth Love
United Kingdom
238 Posts |
Posted - 18/09/2014 : 10:44:13
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I don't know about healing and reconciliation. As a result of this campaign, the facts that have emerged and the actions of the UK government, I now no longer feel remotely British. Any loyalty I had to the concept of the UK has gone, although I'm still fond of its constituent countries. The union flag will find no place in my home. And I have no doubt that there are many many thousands of others in Scotland who feel exactly the same.
Whatever the result, the nation has been fragmented.
DT
But I Can't Understand
Why We Let Someone Else
Rule Our Land
Cap in Hand.
(The Proclaimers) |
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John9
Old Love
United Kingdom
2154 Posts |
Posted - 18/09/2014 : 11:25:52
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Naturally, I'm very sorry to read of so much unhappiness, Davey Tee. But whatever the outcome, there does have to be a way forward that most people can live with.... even though in the immediate aftermath of referendum there will almost certainly be a very large and extremely disappointed minority.
Speaking as someone who has travelled widely in Scotland these last fifty years and who has always had a fascination for Scottish history, I would find it difficult to make up my mind if I had the vote. I'm largely apolitical and I find myself admiring, for their different qualities, people from quite a wide range of the political spectrum. Very much at the head of the list would be the late and much missed Margot Macdonald...especially for the unique stand that she took over so many years. I've never tired of listening to Alex Salmond and Nicola Sturgeon - but equally I've a lot of time for Ruth Davidson and Annabel Goldie.....and even George Galloway I can take in small doses! Throw into the mix as well, the contrasting views of some favourite people from the arts...primarily Liz Lochead, Brian Cox and Neil Oliver.....and it all adds up to a complex picture...and I would probably just go with my intuition in the end.
I would just add that for those of us who actually care about such things in the rest of the UK, the last few months have been deeply unsettling ...and I can scarcely imagine anything less attractive or more worrying than the rise of a nascent English Nationalism. My preference is always for what unites humanity rather that which divides it.
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Edited by - John9 on 18/09/2014 11:44:45 |
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DaveyTee
Fourth Love
United Kingdom
238 Posts |
Posted - 18/09/2014 : 12:16:30
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Not so much unhappiness, John - more frustration and anger. I don't think that people living outwith Scotland are fully aware of the political upheaval that has occurred here during the last few months. The campaign has been taken away from the politicians, who have to some extent been left trailing in its wake, and has been taken over by the people. There have been hundreds of meeting, large and small, all over the country, many without a recognised politician in sight, and certainly the Yes campaign, vilified by most of the media, has relied on word of mouth, discussions in the workplace, and above all the social media to spread its word. We have to some extent woken up to just what the people can do if they really want, and I'd love to think that, regardless of the result, this people power could spread to the rest of the UK. I sometimes think that that is what has frightened the politicians most about this campaign - that the internet especially has given the people a route to knowledge that isn't controlled by the establishment, and that the people are learning what to do with it and are finding that you don't have to have establishment politicians to lead the way.
DT.
But I Can't Understand
Why We Let Someone Else
Rule Our Land
Cap in Hand.
(The Proclaimers) |
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lemonade kid
Old Love
USA
9876 Posts |
Posted - 18/09/2014 : 17:52:33
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Thanks, guys. Exactly the kind of dialog I hoped for. I'm tuning into Al Jezeera America often today for the in-depth news about the VOTE... my favorite (NEW for us here) news organization for the real stories and in-depth reporting.
My ancestry is partly in the UK and partly in Scandinavia, and I have a strong feeling and connection to both.
Scotland, Wales, Ireland, England all so deeply felt, through my love of UK music, film, & literature, from Dylan Thomas to Tolkien, Dickens to Shakespeare, Beatles to Badfinger, Bert Jansch to Donovan, Monty Python to Sherlock Holmes, Hitch to Sir Alec...love you all.
Even the well-known bring the division to the forefront...Connery vs Rowling
In any event...you'll always be the magical British Isles to my mind, and hopefully united at least in heart, even in your (possibly new found) independence.
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"After silence, that which comes nearest to expressing the inexpressible is music".
-Aldous Huxley |
Edited by - lemonade kid on 18/09/2014 17:59:30 |
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John9
Old Love
United Kingdom
2154 Posts |
Posted - 25/09/2014 : 21:55:14
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Speaking of Sir Alec - The Ladykillers was on telly here yesterday afternoon - I now see it as one of his very best performances.
Leaving aside the controversy of the Referendum, the wonderful cultural wealth and diversity of the British Isles really is to be treasured - and I love the idea that so many Americans have a stake in it. Someone who united ordinary British and Americans in their love of liberty was Tom Paine - and I always keep in mind something that he wrote:
My country is the World
my religion, to do good. |
Edited by - John9 on 25/09/2014 21:55:56 |
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lemonade kid
Old Love
USA
9876 Posts |
Posted - 26/09/2014 : 17:17:47
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quote:
Originally posted by John9
Speaking of Sir Alec - The Ladykillers was on telly here yesterday afternoon - I now see it as one of his very best performances.
Alec is quite wonderful in that great great film--my favorite role by Sir Alec too. The whole cast is perfection, especially Mrs. Lopsided (the ever sweet Katie Johnson), One-round....all such perfectly drawn characters. And of course Peter Sellers is funny as usual. Hard pressed to find a more perfect cast.
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"After silence, that which comes nearest to expressing the inexpressible is music".
-Aldous Huxley
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Scotland-YES or No?!
