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watchinallthapeople
Fourth Love
155 Posts |
 Posted - 12/11/2008 : 01:04:19
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Just to be a contrarian twat
If everybodies all concerned about animals suffering due to farming
then what about all the other animals killing each other?
If my (absolutely awesome) cat brings back another smaller animal should she be guilty?
Lions eating springboks?
The veritable slaughter that goes on every second in a rainforest?
I can see the ecological argument against eating meat but the ethical one just seems pretty weak
Incidently my cat is actually pretty close to a vegan
she just drinks water and eats biscuits and the occasional bug
(but I think the bugs are probably more for fun than the nutritional content although I'm no dietician)
its the strangest ****
we've been trying to get her to eat meat (from a tin) for years as we thought it might be bad for her health as they're naturally meant to be carnivores
but she will literally go days without eating until will give her the biscuits
trippy ****
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watchinallthapeople
Fourth Love
155 Posts |
Posted - 12/11/2008 : 01:14:03
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On the best albums!
The Black Keys "Attack and Release"
The Roots "Rising Down"
Beck "Modern Guilt"
Neil Young "Chrome Dreams II"
TV on the Radio "Dear Science"
:) |
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caryne
Old Love
United Kingdom
1520 Posts |
Posted - 12/11/2008 : 12:18:09
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quote:
Originally posted by watchinallthapeople
Just to be a contrarian twat
If everybodies all concerned about animals suffering due to farming
then what about all the other animals killing each other?
If my (absolutely awesome) cat brings back another smaller animal should she be guilty?
Lions eating springboks?
The veritable slaughter that goes on every second in a rainforest?
I can see the ecological argument against eating meat but the ethical one just seems pretty weak
Incidently my cat is actually pretty close to a vegan
she just drinks water and eats biscuits and the occasional bug
(but I think the bugs are probably more for fun than the nutritional content although I'm no dietician)
its the strangest ****
we've been trying to get her to eat meat (from a tin) for years as we thought it might be bad for her health as they're naturally meant to be carnivores
but she will literally go days without eating until will give her the biscuits
trippy ****
I'm guessing you are just trying to be funny?
The big difference, as I am sure you are aware, is humans have a choice, other animals do not. It is that simple. Other animals do not factory farm, raise other animals in terrible conditions and then kill them. They merely (as humans did thousands of years ago) hunt and gather. The animals that other animals hunt and kill lived natural lives until the moment of their death.
I do not have to kill any living creature for my food supply, I exist very healthily without contributing to any slaughter and suffering, that is the difference. That is the ethical reason. |
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lemonade kid
Old Love
USA
9873 Posts |
Posted - 12/11/2008 : 14:39:46
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quote:
Originally posted by watchinallthapeople
On the best albums!
The Black Keys "Attack and Release"
The Roots "Rising Down"
Beck "Modern Guilt"
Neil Young "Chrome Dreams II"
TV on the Radio "Dear Science"
:)
I'm curious about Neil's "Chrome Dreams II"....I love Neil--what direction did he go on this album, or is it a compilation?
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Good people are good because they've come to wisdom through failure. ---- William Saroyan |
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watchinallthapeople
Fourth Love
155 Posts |
Posted - 12/11/2008 : 20:24:03
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Caryne
Hey a bit of humour (but its true about my cat!)
My argument on that matter would be factory farming is a hideous thing
but if animals are free range they live a much better lifestyle than if they were fending for themselves in the wild
Death is a horrible thing no matter what happens but from my perpective
its alot more humane to kill a cow or a pig with a quick shot to the head (instantaneuos)
than to be torn apart by a pack of wolves and eaten alive (can last up to hours)
which is what would happen to any farm animal if it where in its natural environment
If every one gave up eating meat and all farm animals were sent to nature reserves the only way to stop them being slaughtered in unpleasant circumstances would be to regularly hunt and kill their wild predators which would essentially be more killing of animals by humans
The animal kingdom is cruel and so I'd say well regulated free range farming is better than everyone becoming a veggie
I totally respect vegetarianism as a personal choice
Lemonade Kid
Yeah I love it
Its grungey Neil more than Folky Neil that was on Prairie Wind
Ordinary people has more of the awsome brass that was on Prairie wind and is probably the stand out track
Its twenty odd minutes on the album
Neil always knows when he's onto something good eh!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TQVLYR908PA
No hidden path is an awsome rocker too he's been playing it live on the latest tour
www.youtube.com/watch?v=HDtYCuXBnLs
If youre a Young fan you should check out the Black Keys definately got a Neil and Crazy Horse Vibe goin on
This one got some cool banjo, honkey tonk piano etc on this one
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QbtSVWZyL_Y
This ones a straight rocker
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q9AfKcHwoP4
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caryne
Old Love
United Kingdom
1520 Posts |
Posted - 13/11/2008 : 03:06:11
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quote:
Originally posted by watchinallthapeople
Caryne
Hey a bit of humour (but its true about my cat!)
My argument on that matter would be factory farming is a hideous thing
but if animals are free range they live a much better lifestyle than if they were fending for themselves in the wild
Death is a horrible thing no matter what happens but from my perpective
its alot more humane to kill a cow or a pig with a quick shot to the head (instantaneuos)
than to be torn apart by a pack of wolves and eaten alive (can last up to hours)
which is what would happen to any farm animal if it where in its natural environment
If every one gave up eating meat and all farm animals were sent to nature reserves the only way to stop them being slaughtered in unpleasant circumstances would be to regularly hunt and kill their wild predators which would essentially be more killing of animals by humans
The animal kingdom is cruel and so I'd say well regulated free range farming is better than everyone becoming a veggie
I totally respect vegetarianism as a personal choice
Yes it is a personal choice but, guess what, you don't have to kill anything. The world is not going to turn 100% vegetarian overnight so there wouldn't be milliions of farm animals to put in nature reserves... as the need lessened then they simply would not be bred in the numbers they are now and would simply cease to exist as a species. Very few of the animals we eat are natural anyway, they are deformed creations bred for food and nothing like the original cows, pigs, sheep etc. If there are a small number kept (though personlly I fail to see what the point would be in that) I don't really think it would be that difficult to look after them without them being killed by ravaging wolves..this doesn't happen now so why would it if we all stopped eating them. Would the fact that they are being kept as 'pet's make them tastier to the wolves????
No the animal kingdom is not 'cruel', cruelty is a human concept so only humans can be cruel. Non humans do not have an understanding of cruel they just do 'what comes naturally'. As I said, the cat/lion/bear/wolf etc has to kill to survive, it's not 'cruel' it's nature. We do not have to kill anything to survive, that the huge difference. So, there is no logic that it is better to have well-maintained farms, where the animals still die, than to not kill them at all. In fact, and I know you are just trying to wind me up but I might as well reply anyway, your argument is the silliest thing I have ever heard in my life. |
Edited by - caryne on 13/11/2008 03:07:18 |
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lemonade kid
Old Love
USA
9873 Posts |
Posted - 13/11/2008 : 04:10:17
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Yep, neil young is the man, watchin'. Bought his 1968 eponymous LP..in '68, so I was able to enjoy that LP the way Neil intended. Still have it. You probably know the whole re-mastered tracks story.
A 20 minute track!! No one does it like Neil. You must have "living With War". A great album for sure. He had (has)a web page called Living With War that was rather "left wing" to put it lightly. It counted down the number of days Bush had left...gotta check it out now...since the WAR continues.
Do you have the first Crazy Horse LP? A great one indeed!! How about The Rockets LP?
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Good people are good because they've come to wisdom through failure. ---- William Saroyan |
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lemonade kid
Old Love
USA
9873 Posts |
Posted - 13/11/2008 : 04:14:03
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Yep, Neil Young is the man, watchin'. Bought his 1968 eponymous LP..in '68, so I was able to enjoy that LP the way Neil intended. Still have it. You probably know the whole re-mastered tracks story.
Neil never rests on his laurels. A 20 minute track!! No one does it like Neil. You must have "Living With War". A great album for sure. He had (has)a web page called Living With War that was rather "left wing" to put it lightly. It counted down the number of days Bush had left...I gotta check it out now, again...since the WAR continues.
Do you have the first Crazy Horse LP? A great one indeed!! How about The Rockets LP?
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Good people are good because they've come to wisdom through failure. ---- William Saroyan |
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watchinallthapeople
Fourth Love
155 Posts |
Posted - 13/11/2008 : 20:40:06
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Crayne! haha we'll have to argee to disagree! good to have a chat though!
kid
Yeah I love the Danny Whiten stuff that I've heard that album with don't wanna talk about it is a classic, I don't think it ever got released on this side of the pond so I've got a jap import which has that horses head then japaneese text which looks pretty cool!
My all time favourite Young album's "On the Beach",
seems like its after the comedown from the 60's utopianism, bleak and disillusioned but then with ah **** it, what the hell, kind of blissed out, seen the light kinda optimism.
I've got two vinyls one for keeps and one for listenin two as you can't get a CD (last time I checked)!
Not checked out the webpage in a while but it was cool that basically It took someone from the sixties to make a stand against Bush
My generation where pretty lapse although re-deemed somewhat recently.
Heard about his latest project to convert old US cars to hybrids
Here's a vid of his interview on Lettermann where he's talking about the project
www.youtube.com/watch?v=vIZmBa8luEI
He says he's writting a song called "singing a song won't change the world"
Kinda sums him up
alot of bands sit about preachin about **** you know like the Al Gore concerts that used ridiculous amounts of energy but don't do anything
Neil's like I'm gonna make a Cadillac that gets 100 miles to the gallon
nuff respect:)
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lemonade kid
Old Love
USA
9873 Posts |
Posted - 13/11/2008 : 22:05:01
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"On The Beach" is my favorite too (although his first LP will always have a special place in my heart).
The tragic times that led up to the creation of "Beach" started when Neil fired Danny Whiten for being strung out on heroine during "Harvest" rehearsals and so was too out-of-it to perform. Danny just couldn't cut it, so Neil told Danny to go home & gave him fifty bucks ----and told Danny to get himself straight. Whitten took the $50, bought some more heroine & died of an overdose that very night.
Neil has never forgiven himself. Neil lost a soul-mate in music & friend that he loved. Young went on to record what has become known as The Ditch or Doom Triology, with "On The Beach" being the last LP of the Three recorded. It didn't sell well but is considered his best by many. Out of loss and grief, sometimes come the greatest works, I guess.
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Good people are good because they've come to wisdom through failure. ---- William Saroyan |
Edited by - lemonade kid on 13/11/2008 22:06:59 |
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Favourite albums released in the last 12 months
