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myoungish
Fifth Love
USA
264 Posts |
 Posted - 09/08/2008 : 07:44:48
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I can't think of a more divisive record than Four Sail (perhaps Radiohead's Kid A, coming after the majestic OK Computer.) I have friends who are Forever Changes snobs who practically dismiss Four Sail, while others feel it is almost on par with classic Love. I've always adored it, and to these ears there are three stone-cold classics on that record: August, Robert Montgomery, and the profoundly underrated gem that is Always See Your Face. Those who think that Love ended after the Your Mind and We/ Laughing Stock single are sadly missing out. Also, I've heard people comment that Arthur had burned out and lost his muse by Four Sail (1969). He was 24 years old!....Any opinions, objections, emissions?
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Michael Young |
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John9
Old Love
United Kingdom
2154 Posts |
Posted - 09/08/2008 : 10:37:48
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| I can only say Michael, that "I'm with you". 'Four Sail' is an absolutely cracking album and I love it both for its music and its wonderful Elektra styled artwork. Even now I cannot understand how it was denied a decent CD release until 2002. I think that one of the reasons for the music sounding so different from its predecessor is to do with the hiatus in Love's output following 'Your Mind and We'. By the time the new group came to record, rock had acquired a heavier style - with Cream leading the way. It is difficult to compare Love's third and fourth albums - just as the Beatles' 'Sgt Pepper' and its successor, the 'White Album' are different but equally intriguing. For me another indispensable classic from 'Four Sail' is 'Nothing'......ethereal west coast bliss! |
Edited by - John9 on 09/08/2008 10:51:50 |
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The sweet disorder
Fourth Love
United Kingdom
218 Posts |
Posted - 09/08/2008 : 19:25:43
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Hi Gents
I think Four Sail is suffers from what I feel has been Arthur's problem throughout his career. To me his genius is what he is able to take from other people that he knew and worked with and then bring that into his own music. I think Da Capo and Forever Changes are massively influenced from what Arthur took from Bryan. I think he was hearing those Cmaj7 and Fmaj7 chords and romantic visions and twisting them into his own mindset and music.
In my (humble opinion) I think Four Sail has good songs and I don't think he had lost his muse, I personally think it suffers with its production and how some of the songs were worked and played. There are some gems amongst some fairly generic rock songs. namely the three you've mentioned.
I'm mainly on the middle with it. I think the songs are good however I wonder how the Love classic line up would have approached it. I think that would have turned a good album into an outstanding album as some of the songs may have been worked differently
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lemonade kid
Old Love
USA
9873 Posts |
Posted - 09/08/2008 : 20:13:45
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I think "August" from Four Sail is equally complex in composition compared to any thing on FC. I don't think any LP should be "compared" to FC....everything else pales......but I really love "Four Sail" & believe that by any other standard, it is an excellent album.
Arthur just set the bar too high with FC & for some folks... they just can't get past its greatness & allow Arthur to merely create.
Many artists have that one great opus that marks the zenith of their career...everything else just adds to their catalog & becomes part of their musical journey (& some are not as strong a creation, oh well). Let it be. 
trouble comin' everyday.......
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otiselevator
Third Love
United Kingdom
61 Posts |
Posted - 10/08/2008 : 00:44:34
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| Yeah, I was disappointed when I first heard Four Sail. Only "Always See Your Face" and "Robert Montgomery" stood out for me. The playing, especially the lead guitar, sounded stilted and the overall production was weird and seemed lacking after FC. But as John 9 says, rock had become heavier, and over the years I've grown to love it. I'd add both "Singing Cowboy" and "Good Times" to the list of tracks I enjoy and even if it doesn't scale the heights of FC it doesn't sound like anyone else but Arthur. I agree with the sweet disorder that Arthur probably needed a co writer or at least someone to bounce off but I guess he wasn't able to do that after the first Love split up. It's a pity but hey, I personally think there are bits of Out Here and Vindicator which round out the picture of an extraordinary talent. It's a shame the Hendrix sessions seem to be bogus as I imagine they'd add quite a bit to our vision of the man. Taken as a whole, he was pure genius. R.I.P Arthur, we Love you. |
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Joe Morris
Old Love
3491 Posts |
Posted - 11/08/2008 : 00:24:01
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Not a bad album. Would've been better if it had followed da capo and preceded Forever Changes
Sold better than Changes
The trouble was, it was a different band, and Arthur really should've called it something else. Cos the loss of Echols, Maclean, Forssi from the original band, and the loss of the newly added Stuart.. Christ, talk about a flesh wound!
It is good he went on, but it wasn't the same band. Forssi noted in a Discoveries (Goldmine?) interview (reprinted in Castle #3) that the later Love didn't have the magic
Not that the original Love didn't misfire ("Revelation" is, quite simply, appalling) but Arthur shouldn't continued as Love. Should've done something with Hendrix, or called it Band Aid, or ANYTHING. Cos it wasn't Love. It didn't really sound like the earlier love (melodic, interesting lyrics)
Compared to FC it just wasn't gonna measure up, and the whole band was gone! |
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rocker
Old Love
USA
3606 Posts |
Posted - 11/08/2008 : 14:35:32
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I know we all have our favorites from Love. I've always liked the record. I'm not saying to say it's a a great masterpeice as FC but it's Arthur going in another musical direction and as we know he usually did). And I always had it in the back of my mind that he based the "Four Sail" title with word-play based on the album from the Beatles' "For Sale". "Four Sail" as I look at it was a natural for Arthur coming off the hazy and cryptic FC. It was getting back to a rock that was kind of going on during the time.
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bob f.
Old Love
USA
1308 Posts |
Posted - 12/08/2008 : 03:32:49
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i bought the LP when it was first released. i was excited by the new band, and Arthur Lee back for us! August is my favorite track. Robert Montgomery, Always see your face, ...."I'm with you" is wonderful. "nothing", "always see your face".....
i saw that band at the Whiskey a-go-go soon after the release, and was blasted out of my head!
sure, it's not the boys of the classic LOVE, but nothing compares!
F.C. is in its own category, and i still love "Four Sail"!!!
...what the world needs now... |
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Joe Morris
Old Love
3491 Posts |
Posted - 12/08/2008 : 05:34:00
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Arthur said later he named the album Four Sail as he was gonna split the label, that was his way of saying bye bye?
Dunno if thats true - could just be Arthur(ly) playing on words - the whole Four/For thing (see "Which witch is witch?" & etc) and the fact that this was the fourth album for Elektra (fourth no relation to forth, as in Blackadder goes forth, etc etc)
I do think that Jac Holzman was the last to learn of Love leaving the label - he read about it in the trades!
I guess by that point he had to pick and choose the best of what Arthur & co had recorded to make up an album!
I don't listen to the album much, I admit. Its cool Arthur (ly) used to encore with Singing Cowboy, though I tend to prefer the later version on Real to reel!
Nothing is good though (surprise that wasn't on the Love Story best of, but I guess you can't have everything). The only song that I think is a rotter is "Talking in my sleep" - not much of a melody to that one
"Always see your face" was used to great effect in High Fidelity (the film) though I never quite liked the horns on the track; a little too menacing!
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John9
Old Love
United Kingdom
2154 Posts |
Posted - 12/08/2008 : 17:59:40
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| 'High Fidelity' - great film and a superb performance from John Cusack. The soundtrack also features another 'Four Sail' cut .."Your Friend and Mine"....and just for good measure Love's 'My Little Red Book' plays over the closing credits. I think we had a thread going a while back on 'Love at the Movies' - but no one ever seems to mention 'Hideous Kinky'. This touching feature tells the story of a young idealistic hippy travelling with her two small daughters in Morocco in around 1968. The narrator is in fact one of the daughters who is looking back on what happened from a vantage point of about 30 years distance. Apart from including 'Alone Again Or' in the soundtrack, the film stars the truly adorable Kate Winslet. A few years before, I had seen her on stage in Manchester in Joe Orton's 'What the Butler Saw' - this of course was long before before she boarded THAT ship at Southampton! |
Edited by - John9 on 12/08/2008 18:43:39 |
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Lizzyb
Fifth Love
United Kingdom
470 Posts |
Posted - 12/08/2008 : 19:32:23
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Always see your face is my perfect song for remembering Arthur. We had some wonderful versions from him on recent tours.
...and without the horns we would never have had the magic moment in Big Hands, manchester when one of the Stockholm strings and horns played along with it.
Keep on shining |
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Four Sail...the great divider
